"No More Manana, Senor"
LETTERS TO THE
wai.Pi1;V
eb rEitigaw Daitj
Seventy-First Year
EDITED AND MANAGED BY STUDENTS OF THE UNIVERSITY OF MICHIGAN
Opinions Are Free UNDER AUTHORITY OF BOARD IN CONTROL OF STUDENT PUBLICATIONS
th Will Prevail" STUDENT PUBLICATIONS BLDG. * ANN ARBOR, MICH. * Phone NO 2-3241
litorials printed in The Michigan Daily express the individual opinions of staff writers
'or the editors. This must be noted in all reprints.
AY, MARCH 23, 1961 NIGHT EDITOR: PETER STUART
Bermudas, Slacks:
Role Reversal?
Gargoyle Try Squelched
By Publications Board
IE GARGOYLE, ITS voice enfeebled by a
near death sentence last year, has had what
ears to be its last outcry, deftly muted by
Board in Control of Studeht Publications.
iterest in renewing, the campus humor
;azine caused two different student groups
approach the Board this year and ask to
a new Garg. The two formed a coalition
Zinated by freshmen and sophomores with
ide range of artistic and literary experience.'
r the last few months, these students labor-
over a dummy issue of the magazine which
presented to the Board for consideration
week.
he~proposed Garg met with heavy criticism.
was labelled "highschoolish" and ' im-
ure," "irresponsible" and "unrealistic" and,
most unkindest remark of all, "humor-
"
3E BOARD AND the magazine's writers and
editors have opposing views on the quality
he production. Whether or not it qualifies
a good humor magazine is but a question
aste. The Board, which has the power to
tinue the nonexistence of Garg, did not
it and so it won't reappear.
Rote
The Board has failed, however, to state
whether or' not any of the previous Gargs,
published under its control, have met the
standards of good humor magazines. The
Board has not indicated to the magazine's
compilers precisely what they did not like
about it; the criteria used to assess the maga-
zine are left unnoted.
THESE ARE SIDE issues to the argument,
however. The University does not have a
humor magazine. A group of students desire
to have one to such a degree that they have
banded together and, with faculty advice, pro-
duced a mock issue. The quality of the maga-
zine is not a determination the Board should
make as long as the proposed copy and pic-
tures stand within legal limits of libel and
pornography.
The seriousness of the students involved
cannot be questioned when one examines the
: hours of thought and work that have gone
into their efforts and their character and
purpose displayed in meetings with Board
members for nearly a year.
These people should be allowed to publish
the Garg at whatever level of quality they
can produce it. Campus criticism and accepti-
bility of the magazine will determine its suc-
cess or failure.
THE BOARD HAS had a remarkably fine re-
cord of preserving editorial freedom for
The Daily; it may not like what appears in
the newspaper's pages, but it has not question-
ed the right to have such matter printed. It
has been the editor's responsibility to main-
tain a level of quality in his publication, not
the Board's.
Freedom from censorship and freedom for
expresion are as necessary for a humor maga-
zine as they are for any publication, especially
when that publication operates with the con-
text of University' ideals The Garg must
operate as a free agent if it is to educate its
staff,. its subscribers and aid the University
to improve itself.
IWITHITS MONOPOLY on publication, the
Board has an added responsibility to re-
establish Garg if a group is willing to edit and
can demonstrate a staff structure which allows
for perpetuity.
The grounds on which the Board cancelled
the Garg for this year, a lack of qualified ap-
plicants for the editorships and an alarming
lack of staff continuity, may be a valid one.
The justification for hindering publication
next year, a subjective criticism of its quality,
is most definitely not.
-MICHAEL OLINICK
WALTER LIPPMANN:
The Vote O o
To the Editor:
PROM THE MANY and varied
discussion now taking place, it
is obvious that there has been a
change in feminine attire on the.
University campus. The casual ob-
server has noticed this change in
public gathering places, such as
the libraries or restaurants; in the
residence halls; and in the class-
rooms. This trend has had its
effect in that it has brought com-
ments from non-University, Ann
Arbor residents; prospective stu-
dents visiting the campus; parents
and friends of present students;
and official guests of the Uni-
versity.
But the important thing is the
effect upon campus attitudes and
behavior, obvious to the students
themselves. Problems concerning
campus standards of dress can
be solved only by a sincere effort
of the women students. Consider-
ation must be given to the idea
that dress and grooming is impor-
tant in maintaining identity as
women. Dress, therefore, must be
considered as one means to look-
ing and acting like a woman. Be-
cause women set social standards
for both men and women, re-
sponsibility in this area must be
recognized.
BERMUDAS AND SLACKS can-
not effectively create a womanly
appearance. Behavior patterns in
bermudas and slacks are different.,
This is the reason they are con-
sidered to be sportswear. They
fiilitate running, climbing and
general relaxation (generally In
a slumped, awkward position).
There is a certain amount of dig-
nity and composure, along with
the respect that women should
command, that is lost by wearing
them. Obviously, sportswear has
its place-in a picnic area or on
the beach. Obvious, too, is the
fact that femininity is not synony-
mous with the expensive of the
"glamorous." But women should
prefer todlook like women-in
dresses and skirts.'
A woman that looks and acts
like a woman flatters men her
own age and displays respect for
men that are older than she. For
most dates, slacks and bermudas
are an insult to escorts. Appearing
in the classroom, a suposedly for-
mal situation, in sportswear is
certainly not a compliment to the
professor. Well-grooomed women
can set the tenor of a social situa-
tion. All of us have noticed tha
difference in atmosphere in a resi-
dence hall dining room on a Sa-
turday, when everyone is wearing
slacks and pincurls, and at Sun-
day dinner when the women are
dressed in heels and dresses. There
is a difference in everything from
volume of noise to general friend-
liness.
* .9 *
BOTH MEN AND women will
respond to the effort that a girl
puts into her grooming and ap-
pearance. I am not suggesting
that women students attempt to
wear heels at all times, but an
interesting experiment is to try
wearing heels for one day of
classes. A student will find her-
self being complimented, having
doors opened for her-in general,
she will be treated like a woman.
We must face the fact, and en-
joy it-we are going to live the
rest of our lives as women. Most
of those who marry will marry
men in professional fields. Being
feminine displays respect for their
status as well as one's own. Fur-
thermore, a woman's behavior I
important to the maintenance
and advancement of her husband's
career. It is not uncommon for
employers to consider the qualifi-
cations of a wife as important as
those of her husband. Career wo-
men, too, must be responsible in
this area. There are recruiters
from all over the country inter-
viewing potential employees that
may be among our student body.
As standards relax, they will look
elsewhere for well-groomed. self-
possessed men and women. The
college woman is most likely to
be found working In a professional
world where the maximum Stan-
dards of grooming and appearance
will be demanded from her.
THERE IS, THEREFORE, more
than a problem of what is "eas-
test" or "most comfortable" In
volved in present conflicts over
standards of dress. There is a
more basic consideration which
eachwoman on this campus must
face: is there not more to gain by
accepting the role of a wonan!
-Joan ComrIan.
AT THE MICHIGAN:
Squarec'
THE ONLY PERSON who re-
mained deceived in the "Circle
of Deception" was the, director,
who thought he could tack a face-
tious ending on a dramatic story
and thereby satisfy the sentimen-
talists too. Well, he failed and al-
most completely ruined the movie.
After getting the viewer' to ad-
mit- that in wartime It Is ofte
necessary to break one man to
save thousands of others, and after
sending this man through his tra-
gic paces, the director pulls out,
the rug with ten ridiculous se-
conds of rehabilitation.
Almost as big a mistake was the
suicide attempt which should have
been the most dramatic moment
HE OVERSTATED IN this
scene, when he could have used
nderstatement as he did in the
air raid scene. It had impact with-
out blinking lights, and only a
little room shaking. The bomb
explosions getting closer, and the
growing fear on their faces were
enough. Suggestion that evokes
either sympathy or empathy. Is
better than any explanation that
leaves one embarrassed by its
naive directness.
Underplaying the story is the
quantitative problem in philoso-
phy: is killing one man ay less
worse than killing several thou-
sand. The death of unseen thou-
sands should be avoided if poss-
ible, but it's unlikely to disturb
anyone's sleep. The torture of some
individual is usually fascinating
and' after it's, all over, only . the
readjustment problems remain,
and they belong to the tortured.
THE MOVIE STOPS here. The
facetious ending blocks any fur-
ther thought. The tortured man
(Bradford Dillman by the way) is
not shook up after all.
-Thomas Brien
4
I
4
4
Vote
tECENTLY, IN A discussion with a Union
committee chairman, the question of how
e Union President ought to vote as a mem-
r of SGC was considered. The committee
iairman noted that "The Union President
ould represent the best interests of the
rion.'
This is in many ways an unhealthy attitude.
' the ex-officio members of SGC, only the
esidents of IQC, IFC, Panhel and Assembly
present definite segments of the University
pulation. Presumably, they should represent
e "best interests" of the organizations which.
i'Y represent.
However, the Presidents of the Union and
ague, and the Editor of The Daily, can not,
any sense. be considered representatives
a particular student group. Their function
i SGC, it would seem, would be to represent
e best interests of the entire student body.
And anyone might hope that these interests
mld coincide with the best interests of their
spective organizations.
--G. GUSSIN
Student Movement Strikes Again
'HE "STUDENT MOVMENT" has struck
again.I
Wayne State University has fallen to the
mplexly interconnected monster that is
reading across the country. The Wayne
udent Party has broken in two.
About twenty students, dominated, by na-
:nal "student movement" leaders, their philo-
phy and their pawns, have started a new
impus political party, the Liberal Student
rty, to-oppose the unadulterated radicalism
'the parent Student Party.
'HE NEW PARTY is composed of what may
be called "the new students." They are
dicated to "liberalism," although most of
em don't know quite what they mean by
is-they just follow the current line, created
id interpreted by about two dozen people
ross the country.
These two dozen supply nice essays on what
te modern student must be. Then they in-
rpret them to the great unwashed masses'
z, American campuses. Most of them are well-
tentioned. Some of them even know what
tey stand for.
They are all good at telling everyone else
hat they should stand for, and the horrible
art of this is that they are efficient--they
cceed in brainwashing too many into
Loughtless conformity..
Their organizational ties. are loose. They
id those who are led to believe their propa-
inda run many of the "liberal" organizations
1 United States campuses.
'HEY MEET AT National Student Associa-
tion conferences--NSA is a useful body for
Lem; like most quasi-representational assem-
Editorial Staff
THOMAS HAYDEN, Editor
NAN MARKEL JEAN SPENCER
City Editor Editorial Director
ENNETH MoELDOWNEY....... Associate City Editor
JDITH DONER.......... ,..ersonnel Director
HOMAS KABAKER................Magazine Editor
AROLD APPLEBAM .. Associate Editorial Director
OMAS WITECKI...................Sports Editor
blies, it can be railroaded into almost any-
thing {by a well-disciplined organization.
It is here that you Ewill find many of the
documents of the new religion published. It
is then the task of 3 these leaders to see that
they are allowed to interpret the documents-
to point out what they mean in terms of action.
These two dozen or so, some of whom are
actually still students, are the high priests of
the action cult.
THE WSU STUDENT Party was relatively
harmless. It was radical and dedicated to
the spectacular for the sake of exhibitionism.
It repeatedly threatened such useless demon-
strations as picketing of the,,VSU adminis-
tration building.
The members of the Liberal Party, who left
the parent group in disgust, are intelligent and
coherent; the Student Party members are not.
The Liberals realize that compromise and
cooperation with the administration is neces-
sary for effectiveness: the Student Party mem-
bers are committed-if only to the radical and
spectacular. They do not compromise.
T ESTUDENT PARTY has a constitution,
but its members phy it' little heed. It speaks
nicely of such concerns as academic freedom
and the rights of students, but the members
don't worry about these issues-they want to
picket the administration over actions that
displease them.
The Liberal Party also has a constitution. It
is modeled on NSA suggestions. In fact, it
includes, word for word, clauses concerning
"the use of proper channels" and "cooperation
with the administration" that are suggested
by NSA. And not only this, but the members
seem to believe in these methods--they realize-
that they are the only effective methods.
OF COURSE, THE Student Party is ineffec-
tual, if and when it ever acts-spectacular
racicalism doesn't seem likely to affect Ameri-
can university administrators.
The new party was recognized almost im-
mediately after its formation. Its hard-corer
members are all activists; they are ecquainted
with the details of student organization reg-
ulations and with the administration.
They now have a bludgeon with which to
#nnn Th1Aie.11' C'M m~f.nrf ,, Y~ 3
IN AFRICAN AFFAIRS, two
separate but parallel and simi-
lar and historical events took place
last week., One was the refusal of
the Commonwealth nations to
condone the racial policy of apart-
heid in order to keep the Union
of South Africa in the Common-
wealth. The other was the vote of
the United States, differing openly
with its NATO allies, for an in-
quiry by the UN into the Portu-
guese colonial policy in Angola.
In both cases the decision was
a very hard one to take-whether
to risk the unity of the Common-
wealth, whether to risk the unity
of NATO, on a question of prin-
ciple? In both cases there was the
same decision-by the eight na-
tions that if the Commonwealth
was to be preserved, it could not
condone apartheid, by the United
States that NATO and even the
UN itself would be gravely jeopar-
lized if the NATO nations align-
ed themselves in support of colon-
ialism.
THERE ARE SOME who think
that the United States could have
and should have, avoided the deci-
sion. It could have abstained, that
is itcould have declined to vote,
as it did under the Eisenhower
administration last December. But
could the United States have done
that now? Is abstention, a refusal
to vote in order to evade a hard
issue, a workable policy for a
great power which holds the place
we hold in the leadership of the
non-Communist world?
The Eisenhower abstention of
last December could at least be
justified as a stop gap measure in
the closing days of an Administra-
tion. The new Kennedy' adminis-
tration could not take refuge in
the evasion of an issue which in-
volves the destiny of Africa and
Asia and affects profundly the
peace of the world.
When the issue is posed nakedly
as it is in Angola, where it is the
policy of the colonial power not
to prepare the colony for inde-
pendence, how could the United
States refuse 'to declare itself?
Had we done that, we would by
our abstention have abdicated our
influence. For had we abstained,
we would have identified NATO
with colonialism, and the Soviet
Union would have stood out as
the only great power in the white
man's world which took the other
side. What is more, we would have
supported Portuguese colonialism
not boldly by voting against the
resolution but timidly and apolo-
getically by refusing to vote at all,
What an "image" that would
have been of the "leadership" of
the "free world!"
THE QUESTION HAS been
raised as to whether this Ameri-
can vote means that the develop-
ment of Africa has now taken
priority over the consolidation and
stabilization of Europe. It is an
understandable question, and un-
doubtedly there is a 'certain dif-
ference of emphasis between those
who are preoccupied with Euro-
pean affairs and those who are
preoccupied with African affairs.
But the truth is that out con-
The unity of the West is gravely
menaced by the convulsive prob-
lems of Africa.
* . *
THE AMERICAN view, which is
not sufficiently understood in
Europe, is that:the liquidation of
empires is always a great danger
to the peace. The seed beds of the
two world wars were in the liqui-
dation of the Turkish, the Austro-
Hungarian, and the Czarist em-
pires.
In the American view the liqui-
dation of the African empires,,
which is-very far from being com-
pleted, is in this age of nuclear
armaments avery great threat to
peace. Our view is that if we and
the Europeans are to achieve a.
constructive influence in African
affairs, it can be done only
through the medium of the United
Nations.
That is the only forum in which
the old colonial powers, the newly
liberated nations, the Soviet Union,
and the United States can meet
and deal with one another in the
context of the law, of the Charter.
OUR EUROPEAN ALLIES 'must
not underestimate the weight and
the seriousness of the American
judgment in this affair. It is not
inspired by a cheap attempt to win
it is often expressed in the
noble old phrases, the naive
the noble old phrases, the naive
liberal idealism of the old orators.
This judgment, of which the vote
on Angola is a symbol,.comes not
from a soft but from.a hard judg-
ment, a hard judgment based on
two decades of responsibility for
a worldwide coalition.
(c) 1961 New York Herald Tribune, Inc.
Ideally'
THEY MUST BE professionally
first rate or capable of be-
coming so through the training
that will be provided for them.
They must be personally resource-
ful and imaginative in, surmount-
ing the unexpected, the 'difficult
or the routine.
They must be capable of relat-
ing themselves readily to new sit-
uations, new associates and new,
friends. With no trace of patern-
alism, they must be able to co-
operate with Africa in educating
itself.
They must be animated by a
spirit of service that, is ,realistic,
not sentimental, by a spirit of ad-
venture that is durable, not ro-
mantic. They must be knowledge-
able about American life and edu-
cation and ready to learn under-
standingly about the people and
cultures of other lands.
-R. Freeman Butts
The New York Times
,
s. .,n,,., ,,ti.., . .. _._....._.. _____------------------
Ic;DAILY OFFICIAL BULLETIN
__________ A_________ S WI 11'+ f :Aj
The Daily Official Bulletin is an
official publication of The Univer-
sity of Michigan for which The
Michigan Daily assumes no editorial
responsibility. Notices should be
sent in TYPEWRITTEN~ form to
Room 351. Administration Building,
before 2 p~m. two days preceding
publication.
THURSDAY, MARCH 23
General Notices
Regents' Meeting: Friday, April 21.
Communications for consideration at
this meeting must be in the President's
hands not later than April 11.
Residence Hall Scholarship: Women
students wishing to apply for a Resi-
dence Hall Scholarship for the academ-
ic year 1961-62 for Helen Newberry
Residence may do so through the Of-
fice of the Dean of Women. Applica-
tions must be returned COMPLETE by
March 31. Students already living In
this residencenhall and those wishing
to live there next -fall may apply. Qual-
ifications will be considered on the
basis of academic standing (minimum
2.5 cumulative average), need, and con-
tribution 'to 'group living.
Approval for, the -following student
sponsored activities becomes effective 24
hours after the publication of this no-
tice. All publicity for these events
must be withheld until the approval
has become effective.
Alpha Phi Omega, March 27-30, 1961,
from 9-3:00 in Fishbowl, Ticket Sales
for Willopolitan.
Michigan Christian Fellowship, March
25, 1961, 1:00-9:00 p.m., Union, Lecture
and panel discussion of Missionary
work:
Democratic Socialist Club, March 28,
1961, 8:00 p.m. Michigan Union, "Teach-
ers, Taxes, and Technology."
Events Thursday
_ __w _ _ i . ant
Lecture: "Studies on Avidity of An-
tibody" will be discussed by Dr. W. H.
Taliaferro, Argonne National Labora-
tory, Illinois, on Fri., March 24 at 4
p.m. in the School of Public Health
Aud.
High Energy Physics Lecture Series:
Dr. Michael Longs, Physics' Depart-
ment, University of Californiaat Berke-
ley, will discuss "Pion-Proton Differen-
tial Cross Sections and the Newly Dis-
covered Pion-Proton Resonances," on
Fri., March 24 at 4p.m. in 2038 Ran-
dayy Lab.
Astronomical Colloquium: Fri., March
24, 4:00 p.m., the Observatory. Richard
G. Teske of the McMath-Hulbert Ob-
servatory and instrudtor in the De-
partment of Astronomy, will speak on
"'Cepheid Pulsations."
Doctoral Examination for Mark Spi-
vak, Social Psychology; thesis: "Fac-
tors Influencing the Formation of 'a '
Patient-Percept. by Psychiatrists Fol-
lowing the Initial Interview," Fri.,
March 24, 5609 Haven Hall, at 1:00
p.m. Chairman, T. M. Newcomxb.
Doctoral Exaimnation for Borys Dan-
ik, Instrumentation Engineering; the-'
sis: "Optimum Linear Filtering of Sam-
pled Signals." Fri., March 24, 1028 E.
Engineering Bldg., at 2:00 p.m. Chair-
man, F. J. Beutler.
Placement
Beginning Mon., March 27, the fol-
lowing schools will have representatives
at the Bureau to interview for the
1961-1962 school year.
MON., MARCH 27-
Bay City, Mich.-Elementary (K-8).
Flint, Mich.-Elem., Vocal, Art; Jr.
HS Eng., Sci., Home Ed., Math, Ind.
Arts, Core, Girls PE; HS Eng., SS., Sci.,
Fre., Home Ec., Bus. Ed., Math, Art;
Ment. Ret., Sp. Corr., Sight Consv.,
Ortho. Bring Transcript to interview.
Grand Rapids, Mich. (Forest Hills Jr.
& Sr. HS)-Girls Health/Eng./SS, Home
Dearborn, Mich. (District No. 2) -
Elem. (1, 2, & 3); Jr. HS Girls PE,
Eng./SS, Nat. Set.
Flint, Mich.-Same fields as listed
above.
Midland, Mich. -- Elemn.; 'Jr. HS
Speech, Math/Scd.., Choral Music, Ind.
Arts, Eng., Home Ed.; HS Eng., Bus.
Ed., Set., Chem., Math.
Oak Park, Mich.-Elem., PE, Music;
All Secondary; Librarian.
San Leandro, Calif.-Elem.; Jr. HS1
Eng., SS, Phys. Sci., Instr/Vocal Mus.;
HS Art, Bus. Ed., Eng., Germ./Span. or
J~re., Home Ec., Ind. A ts, Math, Set.,
SS, Couns., Girls PE/S$.
For any additional; information and
appointments contact. the Bureau of
Appointments, 3528 Admin. Bldg., NO
3-1511, Ext. 489.
PLACEMENT INTERVIEWS: 'Bureau
of Appointments--Seniors. & grad, Stu-
dents, please call Ext. 3371 for inter-
view appointments with the followings
WED., MARCH-29-
Continental Casualty Co., Chicago-
Location: Home Office &, possibly Nato ie E OE ihd-
tion Wide. MEN & WOMEN with de-
gree in Lib. Arts, Bus. Ad. or Math for
Underwriting, Actuarial; Claims, Pro-
motion (including Advertising),sAgen-
cy, Law, Investment or Accounting and
Statistical Depts.
Prudential Life Insurance Co. of
America, Minneapolis-Location: De-
troit Office. MEN & WOMEN with de-
grees in Gen. Lib. Arts, Bus. Ad. for
Insurance Sales.
THURS., MARCH 30-
KVP Sutherland Paper Co., Kalama-
zoo, Mich.-MEN with degrees in Lib.
Arts or Bus. Ad. for Sales. (Inside &
Territory). Grads in Physics & Math:
for Res. & Dev., and Prod.
THURS., APRIL 13-
State Farm Insurance Co., Blooming-
ton, 11.-Location: Marshall, Mich. MEN
with degrees in Gen. Iib. Arts, Econ.,
Psych. for Insurance (Home Office-
Claims), & OfficeMgmt.
Procter -& Gamle, Mkt. Research
Dept., Cincinnati, Ohio-After 6-8 weeks
Atlantic Cos., NYC-Location: Detroit
and N.Y. MEN with degrees in Gen.
Lib. Arts for Home Office, Sales, Mgmt.
Trng. & Prod.
S. S. Kresge Co., Detroit-Location:
Ohio, Indiana, Michigan & other lo-
cations throughout U.S.MEN with de-
gree in Lib. Arts or Bus. Ad. for Mgmt.
Trng. Prog., Merchandising, & Retail-
ing. This; is not a program primarily
for store managers but rather admin-
istrative positions in District or Home
Office.
ENGINEERING PLACEMENT "INTER-
VIE WS-Seniors & grad students pla.
sign schedule posted at 128 West
Engrg. Bldg.
MARCH 27-
Duriron Co., Dayton, Ohio-BS: I,
ME & Met.-(foundry option). Prod.
General Aniline & Fdlm Corp., An-
tara Chemicals Div., Linden, N.J., &
Calvert City, Ky.-BS: ChE. Des., Res..
& Dev., Sales & Prod.
Lear, Inc., Grand Rapids, Mich.-S,
MS & Prof.: IL or IE w/MBA., 2.5 min.
grade ,point average.rInd. Engrg. &
Prod. Mgmt.' For Grad. Dev. Program
or immediate placement in IE dept.
Parke, Davis & Co.-BS-MS: ChE, IE
lb ME. Men &° WOMEN. Des., R. & D.,
Prod. & Plant Engrg,
SUMMER PLACEMENT:
INTERVIEWS-
MARCH' 23--
Jug Hill-New York coed camp. Mrs.
Esther Kiviat interviewing this after-
noon.
MARCH 23, 24-
H. J. Heinz Co., Holland, Mich.-A.
E. Hildebrand interviewing today from
1:30 to 4:55 pan. and all day Friday.
MARCH 24-
Camp Metamora - Girl Scouts of
Metropolitan Detroit. Miss Elizabeth B.
Wright interviewing Fri. from 1:30 to
4:55 p.m.
/National Music Camp, Interlochen,
Mich.-John Merrill, Director, Inter-
viewing Fri. from 1:30 to 4:15 for men
counselors-19 yrs. & older.
Camp Takona-Mich. YWCA camp.