philosophical outlook, his background, the role of women in Orthodox life, the Jewish family, the situation of Modern Orthodoxy, Israel, Holocaust commemoration, Jewish leadership and, in the final chapter, "Bringing the Messiah ... A Good, Steady Job." The two discuss notions about women's prayer and study, the rabbi's espousal of Jewish pluralism and, regarding the Middle East peace process, his recognition that human life is more important than land, that the holiness of the land must be reconciled with "the dignity of other people, Jewish and non-Jewish." He covers in broad strokes what will be the main themes of his ambi- tious still-to-be-fin- ished book, which he describes as an attempt to present a theology of Judaism through a historical analysis of the development of the covenant in Judaism." With Freedman, he describes the that the core ideas of tzelem elohim human being is created in the image of God — and brit, covenant. "The central anchor of my thinking and of my life is the concept that the human being is created in the image of God. Because humans are the image of God, they are endowed by their Creator with three intrinsic dignities: infinite value, equality and uniqueness. ... This is the guiding principle of Halachah and the ultimate goal behind all mitzvot and religious behaviors," he says, noting that he always tries to act covenantly" with people, "to listen to their own distinctive voice, to recog- nize their personal qualities and to learn from their unique insights." God entered into a covenant (lov- ing commitment) with humans. God will help, God will accompany, God will be involved in every aspect of this effort to perfect the world (the process of tikkun olam). But there must be an active human role in this battle. Human beings are partners with the Divine. God will not give us a perfect world on a silver platter; humans must take responsibility." In a foreword to the book, author Rabbi Joseph Telushkin, who counts himself among Rabbi Greenberg's "disciples," describes him as "a seminal — perhaps the seminal — Jewish thinker of our time." In a wide-ranging conversation about his work, his goals and his conversations with Freedman, Rabbi Greenberg is thoughtful, humble and eloquent; he's an intellectual with great warmth and the gift of making his ideas accessible. His neat office at the Jewish Life Network is the workspace of an admin- istrator; it's in his study in his Riverdale home that he does his scholarly work. Repeatedly, he praises his wife Blu, an author, activist and teacher involved in issues of Orthodoxy and feminism. A father of five and grand- father of l 2, Rabbi Greenberg, who was raised in the Borough Park section of Brooklyn, mentions his father and Rabbi Israel Salantet, a 19th-century leader of the mzzsar (Hebrew for morali- ty) movement, as the two great early influences on his life ; both "impor- tant sources for the idea of the centrality of helping people." Irving Greenberg His father, a rabbi, Talmud teacher and shochet (ritual slaugh- terer), believed that "the last thing one should do is to glorify God at the expense of humans. Rather, one must help people, even 'against' God. He did not really believe that such psak (halachic opinion) was against God; rather this was what God wanted," says Rabbi Greenberg. The rabbi explains that a "central challenge of this moment in Jewish his- tory" is coming to terms with unprece- dented freedom, power and affluence. He sees America as "a wonderful society to be influenced by," providing a 'remarkable framework" for Jewish liv- ing. His aim, through CLAL and his other work, has been to "deepen the Jewish content of Jewish life." From freedom of choice, Rabbi Greenberg asserts, pluralism is an "irre- sistible implication." He has come to believe that "pluralism is a religious and moral necessity." Wile he notes that the Orthodox community thinks it can not legitimate or tolerate pluralism, he's convinced of the reverse: the deeper the commitment, the more authoritative, the more the community needs plural- ism to keep it honest and effective and to prevent extremism or fanaticism." "The Orthodox establishment leader- ship is living in a world where pluralism is impossible," he says, but adds that "a significant minority of the Orthodox community" agrees-with him. He points out that the liberal movements also have problems with pluralism, not in an offi- cial way, but in terms of behavior, atti- tude and language. 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